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Author Topic: Best of Breed Yellows  (Read 3823 times)

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Online Mark_in_Texas

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Best of Breed Yellows
« on: December 16, 2015, 18:01:56 »
We have a huge pool of clivia growers and breeders, with tons of experience, and thus a lot of valuable viewpoints. I would like to know what people think about yellow clivias, which have evolved so much in recent years. Which ones do you think represent the new best of breed, and how do you find them improved over their parents and grandparents? I'm not proposing a debate that will result in one "right" answer, but rather a sharing of the plants you love -- only be sure to give your reasons why. Photos are a big plus in this discussion, as well as the yellow group if you know it or suspect it from breeding experience. Characteristics like compactness, leaf texture, and easy culture can also add merit, so don't just talk about the flowers. And if you feel loyal to an older, tried and true cultivar, then of course you should tout it as well. For you breeders out there, if you favor a yellow but see it as "not quite there yet," then it would be very interesting for you to talk about what would take it closer to perfection. The rest of us could learn from your discerning eye.

Let the posting begin!

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Online DewaldC

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2015, 19:38:45 »
Quote
what people think about yellow clivias
IMHO Group 1 yellows represent the past and Group 2 yellows the future. ;)
If you placed 2 identical looking yellow clivias on a table and told people,that one is a Group 2 and the other a Group 1.
Most would buy the Group 2. :D
 

Offline Martin

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2015, 09:42:58 »
Mark I see no input from the experts so let me give my pennies worth
Group one plants are still stunning and according to my experience they have massive umbels and a must in breeding,if you look at the pinks , peaches that are bred through a yellow like Vico and all the offspring bred through Vico wow they are stunning a good example the plants Carrie put on the pinks and peach bred using Vicothere are still thousands of people who want to have good pinks and breeding Chubs peach on a very good Grp 1 yellow can give stunning offspring,
Good and very good group one yellows are
VICO YELLOW
VICCO GOLD
NOYCE YELLOW AND NOYCE SUNBURST
APPOLINE what a fantastic umbel wow
MISS PERFECT
LADUMA
SERENE
Sean has countless yellows that are stunning
Like the new blushed yellow Sum The su pah hope this spelling is right
So excited
Than Chris Du plessis from Krugersdorp has some japanese yellows that are mouth watering maybe Chriss can give there name
Why would .I still buy group ones because they breed stunning pinks and peaches which still attract a major lot of buyers we sell out of these crosses every year and the diversity that we get is amazing
There are many more good group one yellows maybe we are lucky and some breeders will share
Group 2
I agree with Dewald that group 2 is extremely popular especially with breeding Greens and Bronze plants andit might be the key in breeding with Appleblossom
Good group two plants are
NATAL YELLOW keeps its green for long but the leaves have edge die back although some breeders have overcome that
Cynthia Yellow and Cynthis best a lot of confusion about which is which extensively used by Kirstenbosh and mr Nakamura
Dwesa yellow a habitat plant from eastern cape
Transkei Yellow also habitat plant
Mares yellow
And many more will add to them when I can look at which ones I have in my shade house
A important point is that both groups cater for different combinations of crosses I used group one on interspecific and then I have had stunning plants bred with grp 1 and my favourite plant Naudes getting stunning pinks and blush yellows in my opinion the best breeding plant look what Sean bred with Naudes and grp2 getting the stunning Zol etc from them
Yes a lot of effort is going into Hiraos and yes they are stunning and extremely scarce for now,but if the rumour mill is right there will be tens of thousands coming into the market very soon now that the secrets of Hirao is broken they will improve dramatically with bigger umbels and yes they are a must have
Another very good Group two yellow is Pats Gold a real stunning full umbel
So Mark I hope this helps and maybe someone can learn and the experts share there experience
Regards
Martin
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Offline Martin

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2015, 09:50:10 »
Mark there is another stunning plant owned by Mr Bester called Fintelli gold Wow one of my favourites although I dont know the group it belongs to it should be a must have and then there are the stallwards Watkins yellow and Karkloof yellow and dont forget the Yellows from the States like
Sir John Thouron
Artoros yellow and the new yellow launched by longwood gardens  a stunner my word these three american yellows are good also green clouds of Victor Murillo
Another reason I use grp ones extensively is I breed peach and yellow green throats that is always pleasing to the eye
Martin
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Offline Martin

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2015, 13:04:41 »
Mark some more good yellows
Group two
Centani yellow a very good habitat plant offsets freely although mine is lazy to flower
Port saint johns yellow also a habitat plant from eastern cape when crossed with grp two yellow you get 100%yellow selfed only 50%
Dont forget about the group three yellows they are stunning love Oribi Gorge yellow one of the most sought after plants today fades to pink as it ages stunn7ng
Then there are more groups of yellow that must still be determined
At the end of the day set your goals of what you want to achieve and work towards that and buy the best you can afford and the battle is half one
We have not even touched on the
Yellow variegated Clivia
Yellow Akebono
Yellow Robusta
The world is your oyster and life is too short to satisfy all clivia directions so enjoy every minute
Regards
Martin
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Online Chris du Plessis

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2015, 08:06:33 »
Hi Martin, The yellows I have are not Japanese, but bred by a Japanese gentleman from America, named Hodge Amameya (sp). He visited N-ick Primage in South Africa some years ago, and brought some of his seed as gifts. Oom Braam Opperman was at that stage still befriended to Nick, and shared in these gifts.(At that stage Mr Amameya was close to a hundred years old ). I was indeed very fortunate to have swopped some of my yellow Velthemia seed for 8 of these Hodge Amameya seed then grown by Oom Braam. Four of those seeds produced exceptional flowers - two yellow and two salmon. One of those yellows ( I named it HAY 01 ) produced flowers 110 - 120 mm in size, with a 320 mm head. I am using all four the Hodge Amameya\s in my breeding program, and 2016 will see the second year of flowering of the progeny. I have decided to keep the Hodge Amameya strain pure and see what comes out. Sorry, I dont know how to upload a photo, otherwise I would. -They really are a joy to see. By the way, the yellows  are group 1   
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Online Chris du Plessis

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2015, 08:40:17 »
Sorry, spelling of his name is Hodge Amamiya.
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Offline Lionel Bester

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2015, 08:43:51 »
Hello Chris ,
                  If you wish you could send a pic to one of us on the forum and we could load for you .
I have never seen a Grp 2 yellow that is anywhere near as beautiful as the Grp 1 Yellows .
A mature Natal Yellow is the best of the Grp2 Yellows I HAVE SEEN .
We produce and sell many yellows each year but see very few once they are truly mature .
However , we are working with the best of our Watkins , Vico , Aurea , Morris , Pen Henry and Dave Brundell Yellows .
We do have a Broad leaf yellow breeding program with about 50 selected plants from our collection , but no F2`s have flowered to date .
Here is a Pic I have just taken ... Leaves are about 75mm wide on some , a good start .
My wish is for more compact broad leaf yellows with superior heads of flowers .

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Offline Martin

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2015, 09:06:06 »
Thanks Chriss they are amazing send the photo to my email martinvz@telkomsa.net and I will post it because they must be shared,Lionel I agree with you regarding the umbel and size of group one,we have not even touched on Pen Henry , Kevin Walthers The great wide yellows from Lisa Manion
There are so many excellent yellows that are out there that it will take months to list them all
My favourite must be Appoline, Serene,so Excited,Laduma,the Amemiya from Chris,vico, Fintelli and the new yellow from Sean
Talking about grp 2 Yellows yesterday I looked at some of my AB plants I crossed with grp 2 yellows and they should flower next year with them unpigmented it is holding my breath now,but what would Hirao x AB be like? Anyone try this?
Regards
Martin

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Offline Mike Rummerfield

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2015, 05:51:08 »
Notes from a neophyte:
Please excuse my indulgence here.

Being a beginner in all aspects Clivia, for me it is a matter of availability.  I know this is unsophisticated, but I don't give a hoot as to what's popular or fashionable, Group 1, Group 2, ..... or Group 5 (who knows?).  It is what pleases my eye and what is available that counts, whatever that may be.  Here in North America we are not favored by the Clivia fantasyland (so it appears) you have in the South, so I make do with what I have the most access to, and, in my limited experience, that means Group 1 for the most part.  I am still one year from first bloom of Solomone Yellow X Sir John Thouron, a Daruma Group 1 yellow cross, and many years for an Appoline cross, a Nakamura yellow cross, and various other yellow cross seedlings to bloom.  I would like to add some Vico or ? to that.  The tiniest rootlets are showing on seeds of Arturo's Yellow X self, and Arturo's Yellow X Longwood Debutante - seeds I bought from a North American vendor (I will let her recognize herself if she so chooses).  It is a long journey, it seems, until they will bloom, but I am hopeful.  I'm sure I will be checking in on their progress 20 to the power of 10 times to the point of first bloom and beyond, and hope to enjoy every minute of it, but have to admit it's enough to wear me out just thinking about it.

So, as said, it is many years until bloom at which point I will use those to make my own crosses.  At the point those crosses bloom I will likely have passed on, but hopefully not before passing on my modest collection to a new caretaker.  (Did I just say that!?!  I think I did.)

But then, what I wouldn't do for a Pat's Gold or a Butter Yellow (both Group 2) today.

Mark, you mentioned "taking it closer to perfection".  Of course, as you indicated, perfection can never be achieved, only strived for, and beauty is in the eye of..........    but, for what it's worth, for me a yellow close to perfection would have broad, somewhat arching (to give it some grace), dark green, lustrous leaves with tips of an elegant taper, not too blunt;  a strong stalked, full umbel (but not so full as to be a blob) with full petalled flowers of substance that ✨GLOW✨ with a deep, clear, saturated sunny/lemon yellow;  and to tickle the nose as well as the eye, I don't want to forget a memorable fragrance.  Take a deep breath and feast!   Ah......, one can dream!

Best of luck with your yellow Clivia pursuits, Mark, and to all.   :rule:


From a fellow Clivia enthusiast in the hinterlands,
Mike
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Offline Martin

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2015, 07:11:04 »
Mike you got the basis of a fantastic Gene pool , agree with your sentiments
Martin
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Online DewaldC

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2015, 09:56:17 »
Quote
I have never seen a Grp 2 yellow that is anywhere near as beautiful as the Grp 1 Yellows .
Quote
Group one plants are still stunning and according to my experience they have massive umbels and a must in breeding
The bar with group 1 yellows are so high already,that's exactly the reason why,I have chosen to breed with Group 2 yellows.
At 27 years of age,I feel like I could possibly improve Group 2 yellows to rival Group 1 yellows. ;)

Offline Martin

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #12 on: December 21, 2015, 12:38:21 »
I agree with you Dewald  at your age I would try for a universal yellow that could give all the atributes of a stunning plant JMHO,I believe that this can be achieved in 15 years
I want to improve grp one pinks and peaches as there is still a lot to be done,lucky we all have different tastes imagine if we all just bred one plant would that not be sad?
I hope the best for you in your endeavour and believe you will succeed
Regards
Martin
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Offline Maria

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2015, 18:06:07 »
Charls Green and Hirao Green are Group 2 Yellows.  I still need to see a Group 1 Yellow that is as "beautifully green" as these 2 are.  :)
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Offline Mike Rummerfield

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Re: Best of Breed Yellows/Yellow Groups list
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2015, 01:51:19 »
This might be a good time to repost a post by Gideon on Sept. 22, 2010 on Clivia Groups list:  http://www.cliviaforum.co.za/forum/index.php?topic=14049.0
Is there an update of this list, or a more comprehensive list at this time?

There also is a good article on "THE PROPER USE OF THE DESCRIPTIONS "GROUP 1" AND "GROUP 2" FOR CLIVIA" in the  Nz Clivia Club NewZLetter, Volume 7.1, Summer 2009.  (link):  http://www.nzclivia.org/Newsletters/7.1.2009NewsletterSummer.pdf

Any info that is more current out there?

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